K04 questions and opinions

[Strieg]

Hey all, I've been designing a build plan for my gti, I finally decided on k04 with w/m.

So I've been making my shopping list, and was just curious if I've forgotten anything, just anything I should add in general. Also, I'm going to try and limit flashes/tunes as much as possible. With that in mind... What first? Or just do all the bolt on's and go s2+? Until I bolt on the k04 then retune to k04?

Anyway, here's my list please let me if I've forgotten anything or need to add to.

? Just means I haven't decided on brand yet

Apr Hpfp
3" Catted dp?+ akrapovic catback
Rs4 injectors
K04?
S3/golf r/apr intercooler?
Tune?




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[phil]

Hey all, I've been designing a build plan for my gti, I finally decided on k04 with w/m.

So I've been making my shopping list, and was just curious if I've forgotten anything, just anything I should add in general. Also, I'm going to try and limit flashes/tunes as much as possible. With that in mind... What first? Or just do all the bolt on's and go s2+? Until I bolt on the k04 then retune to k04?

Anyway, here's my list please let me if I've forgotten anything or need to add to.

? Just means I haven't decided on brand yet

Apr Hpfp
3" Catted dp?+ akrapovic catback
Rs4 injectors
K04?
S3/golf r/apr intercooler?
Tune?

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To go from Stock to a K04, you need the following:

S3/RS4 Injectors (APR uses S3, REVO uses RS4. Check with your tuner to see what they have a tune for)
3" Downpipe (Doesn't matter if it has a cat or not. This downpipe will also work with a K03)
K04 Turbo
Upgraded Diverter Valve (Newest revision OEM DV will be fine)
FMIC (Any will work. S3/Golf R is the cheapest. You can run a CTS Turbo one, if you wanted also)
High Pressure Fuel Pump (HPFP Upgrade, APR, IE, etc.)
Tune

Typically, what a lot of people do is:

3" Downpipe
Tune
Upgraded DV

This gets you to Stage 2.

Next, people typically add a HPFP, which gets you to Stage 2+

Then, throwing on an FMIC, no changes to the software.

And then you do a Software Upgrade w/ K04.

That way you can upgrade in stages, and it's a little nicer on your wallet.

If you're trying to do it as cheaply as possible, I reckon you can go with:

APR Tune (Stage 2, then +$300 for K04)
S3 Injectors
eBay Catless Downpipe
OEM Catback (Doesn't really hinder performance at all)
S3/Golf R FMIC
Autotech HPFP Rebuild Kit
OEM DV

There's been a few threads around here, should be able to piece that all together for something like $2200~ or something brand new, if I remember correctly. + the Tune obviously.

 

[zecgti]

Go with DriverMotorsport for tune on either k04 or f23t and can run stock injectors. (Saves u 400$ plus having to pull intake mani)

if u have the $$ to get all the mods & k04 just do it all at once to avoid more tuning costs

If you choose that route.. U will also need golf r map sensor and rs4 prv

 

[GIACUser]

Hey all, I've been designing a build plan for my gti, I finally decided on k04 with w/m.

So I've been making my shopping list, and was just curious if I've forgotten anything, just anything I should add in general. Also, I'm going to try and limit flashes/tunes as much as possible. With that in mind... What first? Or just do all the bolt on's and go s2+? Until I bolt on the k04 then retune to k04?

Anyway, here's my list please let me if I've forgotten anything or need to add to.

? Just means I haven't decided on brand yet

Apr Hpfp
3" Catted dp?+ akrapovic catback
Rs4 injectors
K04?
S3/golf r/apr intercooler?
Tune?




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Doing this in stages will be more expensive because you will need different tunes at each step. Buying and stockpiling your hardware until you have all the pieces, then doing the install and tune is the right way to go.

Also the increased power will likely bring out other weaknesses/leaks in your car. It is good to freshen up things like:

Replace PCV valve and gasket or go with a catch can and a new gasket.
Replace vacuum line that attaches to vacuum pump - common failure
Replace your ignition coils - common point of failure
If you are past 75Kmi I would also do timing belt / water pump / thermostat
If you are manual tranny and have orig clutch plan on buying a new one
If you are DSG and more than 40K mi has gone by since service you should service it.

Folks can add more common points of failure but adding 50% more power has a way of accelerating problems or bringing out problems much quicker. Best to make sure your engine/tranny are freshly serviced and up to the task. Lot of people just add power makers then contend with the problems/failures that follow. I prefer to do as much as possible ahead of time to avoid those problems, so far that approach has worked well for me but it does cost.

Also to get the most out of the K04 there are a few more key pieces that help eliminate choke points of the stock motor. The idea of course is to open up the intake and exhaust so the turbo can move as much air through as possible so you can make as much power as possible.You can put a lot of good stuff in but a couple of choke points can prevent you K04 from reaching its power potential. Specifically all the parts between the turbo and the intake manifold. I would highly recommend:

Both Neuspeed pipes and the APR or Wagner or BSH (very high capacity) intercoolers. I started with S3 but compared to the APR I ended up with it was a choke point.

If you click on my sig you can see my entire build and what worked for me. I have had the car since new in 2008 and over 5 years went through all the stages one at a time. After I finally went K04 I really wish I had done that in the first place. Also I have to put in a plug for Drivermotorsport because their service and tune really pulled my build together and helped me make the most out of all my parts.

 

[nashbar]

skip injectors

 

[vegasGTI]

S3 and golf r ic are not the same. S3 uses metal end tanks golf r is plastic. May not seem like a big difference but it is. For the little extra money go with the S3 metal end tanks are far better. Have also heard good things about the spm fmic. Personally I would go Autotech for the hpfp and save money on a product that is just as good. Also if your Dsg I would get a Dsg tune to save wear on the tranny. As others stated if you go DM for the tune save the money on injectors and just get the Rs4 fuel regulator. If not the best place for S3's is a German seller on eBay, that's where I sourced mine save a couple hundred dollars that way. Dm makes tunes for ko4 that do not require the golf r map, that file is their ko4 plus file, but in the scheme of things the map sensor can be had for around $40 or so so might as well do it. Water Meth is also a good idea. Pcv blockoff is a must.
point of clarification S3/golf r are not true fmic's they are stock placement units that are behind the radiator. Personally I would stay away from APR. This is my personal experience/opinion from 15 years of being in the industry. Please don't anyone turn this into an Apr vs thing, that is not the point and is counter productive to this conversation.

 

[Red5pade]

What first? just get dms new 3.5" dp (this will help you out when you get the k04), some cai, get a tune (dm is the way to go here... just search this forum and youll see why) Or just do all the bolt on's and go s2+? it doesnt hurt to go s2+ until you get the k04 if you go with some tunes. some tuners just have you pay the price difference from s2 to k04 (usually $100) Until I bolt on the k04 then retune to k04?

? Just means I haven't decided on brand yet

Apr Hpfp that ie hpfp just came out :drool:. i want that thing so bad
3" Catted dp?+ akrapovic catback as i said, that 3.5" dp from dm will help in the long run. catback is more on you. what sound do you like. im going to recommend staying away from ebay crap. i got the chance to see it first hand about a month ago and its a joke. sure it "works" but its complete crap. spend the extra cash and get something nicer
Rs4 injectors just get an rs4 prv and go with dm tune. saves you money and you get the same power. if you still want injectors, go s3. the spray angle is better and you dont look like a dump truck when you floor it
K04? yes, that or a k04 framed turbo, like the f23t or gttx
S3/golf r/apr intercooler? both are great ic's, but the golf r is better. it has 5 more bars for better cooling, the plastic endtanks help for better flow than the metal ones on the s3, and its cheaper. golf r is good enough for k04 cars that just drive on the street.
Tune? dm all day. i feel like a broken record anymore but it really is the only way to go for k03 and k04 gti's. i know they have done a few other turbos but ive only seen 2 bt cars tuned from them, so i cant talk for that

hope all that helps :thumbsup:

 

[flat tire]

Get the

HPFP: IE HPFP $500 rebuilt
Turbo: F23T frankenturbo $1299
Charge Cooling: Water meth (can skip IC for now if you run WM) $300 - $500
Tune: Driver Motorsport (requires upgraded MAP sensor and fuel pressure valve, cost under $200 for both) $575 - $700

Other: New plugs / coilpacks / oil / filter / coolant / brake fluid / air filter

One thing about water / meth is that if you deserve your mods and use them a lot then you'll use a bunch of water / meth. For this reason I recommend a trunk mounted reservoir, minimum 2.5 gallons in size.

 

[Red5pade]

Get the

HPFP: IE HPFP $500 rebuilt
Turbo: F23T frankenturbo $1299
Charge Cooling: Water meth (can skip IC for now if you run WM) $300 - $500$275 for golf r
Tune: Driver Motorsport (requires upgraded MAP sensor and fuel pressure valve, cost under $200 for both) $575 - $700 make sure you get the oem 3bar map sensor if you get one. this is more of a safety precaution because you may shoot past what the stock map can read, which is 22.5psi. if you go past that, you are basically flying blind

Other: New plugs / coilpacks / oil / filter / coolant / brake fluid / air filter

One thing about water / meth is that if you deserve your mods and use them a lot then you'll use a bunch of water / meth. For this reason I recommend a trunk mounted reservoir, minimum 2.5 gallons in size.

im not bashing w/m, but that should be something done later imo. but yes, you will need new plugs (pfr7b's) and get the r8 coils while youre at it cause the stock ones seem to fail pretty quick. you lost me on the brake fluid though :iono:, but the coolant was a good one... i forgot about that

 

[phil]

Seems like I've been out of the loop for too long. DM looks like they're doing some great stuff with the 2.0T FSIs, :thumbsup:

 

[flat tire]

Brake fluid because it's usually neglected and hasn't been changed.

WM does require some forethought and setup, but...if you take the time to set it up right, it is AWESOME because it immediately pushes your intake charge sub-ambient as the water and alcohol evaporate, which is better than any IC can do.

 

[Strieg]

Thanks guys, I appreciate all of the info. Especially the preventative stuff, that's one of the things in particular I wanted to know. I've done some searching but mostly find old threads that never had definitive answers.

I'd like to just order all the parts, and add them all at once, but will it be driveable like that without tune? I like the DM tune idea, but I'm wary because I've never messed with tuning. I was thinking of going with the apr tune, but like I said after I do all the bolt ons, I'd have to drive to the nearest apr shop which is roughly 2 hours away.

As for the maintenance stuff, just replace with stock? ie thermostat coils water pump all that stuff mentioned?


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[Strieg]

Also, it's not my goal to build as quickly or cheaply as possible. I set aside some cash for this, I just want to make sure I'm putting in quality parts. Reliability is very important to me.


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[flat tire]

The car will be drivable without tune but you will suffer various issues unless you stay out of boost.

 

[vegasGTI]

A new ic does something that wm does not and that is increase airflow which is something needed when going to a bigger Turbo. In this case if money is the deciding factor forf only one an ic should be done first