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NEW Öhlins coilovers

Slave IV

Ready to race!
Location
SoCal
Car(s)
MKV R32, B5 S4
Yep..The first pic I posted is from the BMW but our kit will use similar dampers (just the best pic that showed the parts I could find since it is not listed yet).

The second pic shows the kit (or a similar one) for our platforms installed in a TT-RS.
 

Autobahn

Autocross Champion
Location
Huntington Beach, CA
Car(s)
'18 Golf R
Speaking of Penske, a good friend is getting a set of their shocks through a well known local suspension tuner Erik Messley. They look just like the black and gold units above, pretty nice stuff.

KW has always intrigued with their technology, for instance their 7-post:





This high tech test system is used by Formula 1 teams for their research and development to achieve suspension setups at the highest level of motorsport. KW automotive GmbH uses this innovative technology to test the development of new suspension kits as well as optimising suspension setups. KW offers all interested race teams as well as industrial partners the possibility to set up their vehicles with the support of our 7-post-rig in our specialist testing centre in Fichtenberg. The 7-post-rig consists out of seven hydraulic stamps – four main actuators for the wheels and another three posts to control the action of the vehicle superstructure if necessary. The test rig can be used either in the 4 stamp modus or as the name already says, in the 7 post modus.

In the 4 post modus basic developments can be made, in which the suspension kit will be pulsed in different frequencies and post strokes. For the simulation of race track courses, the 7 posts modus will be used, which offers to simulate brake- and speed up applications as well as aerodynamic demands. This test can be driven with constant and exactly repetitious conditions – much more accurate and faster as on the race track.
 

bostonaudi

Go Kart Champion
Location
Charleston, SC
Car(s)
1995 BMW M3
Wow, that KW test rig is way cool.

The cost of these suspensions for a VW though, seems a little crazy. I think best bang for buck is the Eibach R2 Multi Pro, similar to the R1 setup I had but true dual adjustable dampers with remote reservoirs. With dual adjustable you can more easily adjust for spring rates and road conditions, single adjustable good to a point but tends to work against you when you want to play with spring rates.
 

race bumb

Ready to race!
Location
Willows, Ca
Car(s)
08 GTI
I've got my car pretty dialed in on Club Sports for Thunderhill Raceway. What seems crazy to me is the spring rates for the rear. The rear springs are way too soft unless you like driving a plow no matter what shock you use :/
 
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the bruce

Go Kart Champion
Location
land
Car(s)
Golf GTI Mk.V 2008
I need to share this:

High spring rates can obviously degrade ride, my point was keep ride height stockish and with the right damping the higher rate springs will provide fantastic handling. With correctly calibrated damping, high rate springs are not that bad, try riding in a car with AST or Moton dampers and higher rate springs - magic. However, my point wasn't to go out and get 500 lb springs for a street ride, but if after a good auto-x or track day car, keep near factory ride height, and with stiffer springs and stock height car will be on rails.

VW/Audi does know a thing or two about suspensions, the tweaks they made to the TT prove it, unfortunately VW neutered the GTI with a roll center that needs to have the suspension sitting at stock height to maintain best grip, hence my advise to keep height near stock. They also wanted a certain amount of under steer in these cars as a safety net for the masses.

Koni Yellows with stock springs work great, running this combo now. There aren't issues with high or low speed compression damping, but it does require setting them soft on rebound for good street ride.

The reason you feel less jiggliness with DG springs is the fronts are softer than stock and the factory shocks actually control them a little better. Mk5 fronts are quite sensitive to spring rate changes. I just think the change from stock springs to DG to be subtle enough as to make the expense of swapping them at all debatable. For pure esthetics the early USA Mk5's with silly high factory height surely do benefit, the 08's and up are lowered from factory.

I have tested many different coilovers, companies providing them all have their own takes on rates and damping, I've no evidence they get things any more right, however many use (or have used) Koni's as the damper, so you tend to end up with something that works. Many coilovers on the market are junk, and the Farnorth articles correctly point that out. I used to sell KW as a retailer, they generally make excellent kits, the ST is great bang for buck setup. However the right set of springs on Bilstein or Koni dampers makes just as fine a suspension as any coilover setup, and I would say a better setup - install and forget. Coilovers are wasted on 99.9% of those who install them, and generally result in poorer max grip as the temptation to lower proves too much. Almost no one takes advantage of what coilovers offer - corner balancing, and for street cars its wasted effort. The typical coilover setup isn't compensating for the trashed roll center from lowering with stiff enough springs to keep the car from rolling even worse. If you want grip and lowering, you then need additional static camber and higher rate springs, or fix the roll center with H2sport or TT spindles. I had one of the few pairs of Mk5 spindles H2sport has ever made on my car, the improvement in grip was unreal, and tendency to lean greatly reduced.

Sways are less necessary for cars at near stock height with tall springs because the car still has its roll center intact. On a lowered car with a compromised roll center, additional roll control then becomes necessary to prevent more loss of dynamic camber - milder springs with sway bars generally ride better than a car with the spring rates required to keep it from wanting to roll more. When I had the sport spindles installed, even with up to a 50mm drop and modest springs, the car rolled very little. I would elevate sway bars to a higher level than "last resort", its a lot easier to adjust a bar than to change springs. Mk5's also highly benefit from both front and rear bars.

My ideal street setup is stock springs (or the DG's for a mild drop), Koni Yellows, and a pair of sway bars, and that's what I run now. Another nice improvement is knocking off some unsprung weight through lighter wheels, or converting front spindles and control arms to alloy.

One of the best articles ever written on this forum !! :thumbsup:

:thanks: :thanks: :thanks: :thanks: :thanks:
 

Slave IV

Ready to race!
Location
SoCal
Car(s)
MKV R32, B5 S4
Nice post by bostonaudi..I say the same thing all the time on the other forum I'm on. I ended up making a Suspension Spec thread to help people sort out the differences and make more informed decisions. I don't think I'll copy the thread over here because there is too much info and valuable input from other posters there but here is a link for those interested.
 

race bumb

Ready to race!
Location
Willows, Ca
Car(s)
08 GTI
All I'm saying is these setups, out of the box, will not work well on a track. I have a trash can full of coils and many test days playing with shock setting,rear ride height and springs at Sears Point and Thunderhill. Do what ever you want with the street. I'm just putting in my 2 cents worth for track cars which I thought this forum was about.
 

Slave IV

Ready to race!
Location
SoCal
Car(s)
MKV R32, B5 S4
I'm pretty sure the PSI Ohlin kit will be the best off the shelf kit for the track available. PSI works with customers to custom dial their kits in for whatever purpose you want. You get the spring rates you want. I agree that most the spring rates are too low, especially in the rear. If I were doing it, I'd want slightly higher rates in the back.
 

GodSquadMandrake

Radioactive Rotary Rocket
Location
Minneapolis
Finally they did this.
 

RRacerguy717

Go Kart Champion
Location
ny tristate
I'm pretty sure the PSI Ohlin kit will be the best off the shelf kit for the track available. PSI works with customers to custom dial their kits in for whatever purpose you want. You get the spring rates you want. I agree that most the spring rates are too low, especially in the rear. If I were doing it, I'd want slightly higher rates in the back.

If I was looking for custom setup at reasonable price espec if was living cali like you are I would contact Steve in the link below. He designs specific suspension products for ground crontrol and has setups for all mkiv and mkv/VI he owned each of them and built kits for them. I think he in northern Cali very smart guy great vw specfic suspension resource. Bob G http://forums.vwvortex.com/member.php?18298-reflexgti. :thumbsup:
 

Slave IV

Ready to race!
Location
SoCal
Car(s)
MKV R32, B5 S4
If I was looking for custom setup at reasonable price espec if was living cali like you are I would contact Steve in the link below. He designs specific suspension products for ground crontrol and has setups for all mkiv and mkv/VI he owned each of them and built kits for them. I think he in northern Cali very smart guy great vw specfic suspension resource. Bob G http://forums.vwvortex.com/member.php?18298-reflexgti. :thumbsup:

Thanks! I know about Ground Control..PSI works with them too. I'm actually not in the market for coilovers and just posted here to share the info I recently heard about. The PSI guys are also in CA and they work with 034 and also develop full blown race car suspensions. I know Ground Control has helped a few people get their Ohlin VWS MI00 dampers dialed in with custom springs rates and their coilover conversion kit/camber plates. I'm sure you can't go wrong with either place but PSI is the one that developed the ones I posted about.

I'm actually one of the few here who thinks the stock suspension is fine and not the real weak part of the car. It's been improved significantly just by adding the subframe collars and mounts that I did. If I do get something down the line, I will get the PSI Ohlins or whatever is best at that time. Meanwhile, I still think driver's training is the best way to get more performance out of your car and I still have a lot to learn.

Great thread and discussion here:thumbsup:
 

GTI_Speed

SteelCities SCCA AutoX
Location
Pittsburgh
Car(s)
08 GTI
I've got my car pretty dialed in on Club Sports for Thunderhill Raceway. What seems crazy to me is the spring rates for the rear. The rear springs are way too soft unless you like driving a plow no matter what shock you use :/

Ahh a fellow Club Sporter, just wondering if you are still using the springs that came with the suspension kit? I just installed new springs, same stiffness but an inch taller, with some poly rear control arm bushings and holy crap does the car feel better in almost every aspect. It accelerates better, turns in better, and holds a tighter line while accelerating out of a turn. I'm not sure how braking will be but braking is overrated anyway. :23:

Looking forward to how things go at my first event of the year in two weeks.
 

Autobahn

Autocross Champion
Location
Huntington Beach, CA
Car(s)
'18 Golf R
It's nice to hear you don't have to go out and get a $3000+ suspension to have fun and do well at DE events.

I've mentioned before I ran my car stock except for uprated pads and fluid for around 8-10 DE's. The only thing I didn't like was soft rebound and compression, otherwise I thought the car felt great as long as I drove the proper line.

In the end it all comes down to driving, work with what you have before changing, optimizing, etc...
 

Autobahn

Autocross Champion
Location
Huntington Beach, CA
Car(s)
'18 Golf R
That makes 3 of us now.

I run a spacer to bring the rears up, without the car sits too low and does effect the handling.

I've found running the rear on the higher side keeps the handling good. I'm around 26" FTG in back and 25.5" in front.

The rear compresses a lot



Ahh a fellow Club Sporter, just wondering if you are still using the springs that came with the suspension kit? I just installed new springs, same stiffness but an inch taller, with some poly rear control arm bushings and holy crap does the car feel better in almost every aspect. It accelerates better, turns in better, and holds a tighter line while accelerating out of a turn. I'm not sure how braking will be but braking is overrated anyway. :23:

Looking forward to how things go at my first event of the year in two weeks.
 
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