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(SYD) Northern Drive Message Board!

RobGtSport

Go Kart Champion
Location
Sydney
Car(s)
VW R32
Rocko, bizi, shannon could u pm me your numbers for next time im up there

also need some help, on our way to the drive my tyre pressure warning lamp went off so i pulled over and had a look at the tyres and everything looked fine, so i reset it and the lamp went away, then after we had finished and i was on my way to hunters hill it went off again :( i pulled over once again and there was no flat tyre!!! anyone have any idea why this could be happening?

Cheers
Rob
 
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funny

VCDS guru & soon Dad x2 !
Location
Sydney
Car(s)
Golf MkV GTI MY07
Aww, pity i have had stuff on this weekend.

Rob - did u check the pressure? It doesn't have to look flat to be down.
The only time mine DIDNT go off my front left was down 8-10psi and it didn't look flat.
 

funny

VCDS guru & soon Dad x2 !
Location
Sydney
Car(s)
Golf MkV GTI MY07
No we didn't.

The Unibrace UB tightened up the chassis. No more flexing of the rear - the car feels tight and like one. There is also less vibration in the cabin.

That's good. From the design it should be making front-rear and to some extent side-side and torsional movements lessened. Net effect is suspension has a firmer platform to work from (suspension pushes against car rather than car flexing a little first).


The knock on effect is that the turbo lag is lessened somewhat (as energy is not loss through vibration)

I think this is placebo - the mod should have ZERO effect on turbo lag.
It either means you were going harder with more confidence (not letting rpm drop too much) or possibly less wheelspin as suspension is working better (though i doubt this is the reason as it wouldn't have improved suspension THAT much)

ride on smaller bumps is smoothed over. But the ride is now more jarring over larger bumps (coilovers should solve this).

NVH should be increased most of the time when things are being stiffened up.
The smaller bump improvement shows suspension is working better i think, though if you think about it this could also be placebo as car flex should actually make ride BETTER. If anyone can give a better explanation speak up.

Large bump jarring means suspension is working harder (thats for sure as platform is stiffer). It would have a similar effect to roll bars in stiffening ride although to a lesser extent and without the "suspension" benefits in handling improvements (due to location away from actual wheels)
It could be (what comes to mind now anyway):
  • Bump large enough to let you hit bump stop
  • Overdamped (unlikely for stock)
  • Too stiffly sprung

There seems to be less body roll and I had more confidence on the twisties.
Probably less roll as noted above. I think the confidence is because you're getting out more and in good company!

I still think level 1 & 2 courses are the way to go.

After all my kit is on, i might think of doing the level 2 course again at Wakefield to get an idea of what the at limit difference is to stock. If timing suits, maybe we can do a group. Maybe Q2 2011. You'd need to do level 1 first (and if Saad is still around, he can tell you just how much a difference in learning curve there was when he (minus level 1) and I (with level 1) did it).

Glad to see you're having a good time mate :thumbsup:
 

funny

VCDS guru & soon Dad x2 !
Location
Sydney
Car(s)
Golf MkV GTI MY07
i couldn't tyres were hot

You could still check them to see if there was a difference from side-side.

I have a tyre guage (cheap but luckily very accurate one) 24/7 in the car. Any old cheap one will do - you can cross measure against 2 or more electronic ones (sure they can be wrong too!) to make sure it is pretty close (on or within 1psi).

Rough guide is +1psi for every 5 min (sedate) driving.
No idea how high it gets with spirited stuff. Would vary a lot front-back.

Good way to fill tyres hot if you are far from a station is measure at home dead cold. Drive. Measure again - record/memorise difference. Set pump to desired pressure (allowing for pump error to your guage) + difference. I'm never more than 1/2 psi off what i want when it comes back cold.:thumbsup:
 

Jester_Fu

My Name is Angela.
Location
Swidneh
Car(s)
Daytona Grey TT RS
Rough guide is +1psi for every 5 min (sedate) driving.
No idea how high it gets with spirited stuff. Would vary a lot front-back.
So after an hour, my tyres should explode? :yikes:

Street driving even on longer trips shouldn't result in more than 5-6 PSI variation. On the track with air in your tyres, a 30minute session can result in 10-15PSI increase or more depending on the tyre and driving style. This is where Nitrogen makes a massive difference as it only varies 1-5PSI under heat/driving (from my experience) and hence you can more accurately set tyre pressures when cold = faster lap times more often.

The Aussie VW tyre monitoring is based on a rotational speed difference in the tyres measure by the ABS system. If you check your tyres and left to right, front to rear there is very little variation (5PSI or less) then this could be a symptom of a failing ABS sensor on your disks/hubs. Could also just be some crap in the notches it uses to sense. Have it checked out if it keeps doing it.
 

triode12

Go Kart Champion
Location
Sydney
I think this is placebo - the mod should have ZERO effect on turbo lag.
It either means you were going harder with more confidence (not letting rpm drop too much) or possibly less wheelspin as suspension is working better (though i doubt this is the reason as it wouldn't have improved suspension THAT much)

:


The possibility of the Placebo effect did cross my mind but it does feel like that there is less lag, even the wife noticed it. It could be that the stiffened chassis is allowing the engine with transfer power to the wheels more effectively, rather than being dissipated through as vibration through the chassis. :iono:

Perhaps the engineers amongst us could enlighten us on what might be happening.


NVH should be increased most of the time when things are being stiffened up.
The smaller bump improvement shows suspension is working better i think, though if you think about it this could also be placebo as car flex should actually make ride BETTER. If anyone can give a better explanation speak up.

Large bump jarring means suspension is working harder (thats for sure as platform is stiffer). It would have a similar effect to roll bars in stiffening ride although to a lesser extent and without the "suspension" benefits in handling improvements (due to location away from actual wheels)
It could be (what comes to mind now anyway):
  • Bump large enough to let you hit bump stop
  • Overdamped (unlikely for stock)
  • Too stiffly sprung
:

Perhaps since the suspension is allowed to work better, it is doing a better job of masking the smaller undulations/bumps while larger bumps are unsettling it because they performing that their maximum ability i.e. better dampers/springs required. Again, we'd need an expert on suspensions to explain why so. The stock Pirelli suspension doesn't provide the best ride out there as also reported in at least two local reviews. There are several sections on the OPH where the car will bottom out and scrape the lower lip and the car not even lowered.

Here in, highlights the "problem" with modding. You tweak one bit and it reveals weaknesses in another area, so you tweak it again with another mod...till you find yourself spending a third of the cost of the car for marginal gains.


Probably less roll as noted above. I think the confidence is because you're getting out more and in good company!

I still think level 1 & 2 courses are the way to go.

After all my kit is on, i might think of doing the level 2 course again at Wakefield to get an idea of what the at limit difference is to stock. If timing suits, maybe we can do a group. Maybe Q2 2011. You'd need to do level 1 first (and if Saad is still around, he can tell you just how much a difference in learning curve there was when he (minus level 1) and I (with level 1) did it).

Glad to see you're having a good time mate :thumbsup:

Yeah - good company again. Could only keep up in the short tighter twisties (section after Moonie Moonie), the slightly longer flowing ones (after the turn off to Peat's Ridge) where there are longer stretches to accelerate, still scare the $%%^ outta me - I don't trust my skills, brakes and suspension enough.

The wife and I would be up for Adv driver training lessons.
Was it through Ian Luff?
Cost?
 

RobGtSport

Go Kart Champion
Location
Sydney
Car(s)
VW R32
ok so i just went to the servo to check my tyre pressure
both left hand side wheels were low compared to the right hand side wheels.
(all were below the suggested 180kpa)
pumped them all up to 180+ and wat a difference, car feels much better and grippier
does that sound right?

im going to check for nails in the left 2 tyres soon

Update:

Took rear left tyre off..
Puncture... F@*K!!!!!
its a huge piece of metal

Front left tyre has no punctures :D

Update: went to tyre place this morning and this is wat was in the tyre... its scary now knowing that i got this before we got to OPH, and i wasnt taking it easy on the drive either :S
 

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Bizi

Jetta with Rice
Location
Sydney
Car(s)
Jetta MY07
Would it be worthwhile to try to get a small 'Nthn drive' group together for advanced training at EC sometime?

I enjoy our drives as we are currently doing them but believe it's probably better to leave some of our most enthusiastic cornering moves on the track, rather than test our mods (and our car's and our own abilities) in a safer environment which does not have cliffs, armco, traffic and trees alongside the track. ;)

Such a solution might see us doing 120-30 in corners and some other people in cars with decent RSB mods doing significantly more, Shannon! Because such speeds would not be legal on the roads aside from maybe NT.
 

funny

VCDS guru & soon Dad x2 !
Location
Sydney
Car(s)
Golf MkV GTI MY07
So after an hour, my tyres should explode? :yikes:

Sorry. My omission. :bonk: I forgot that that only applies up to the first 15min. That was from a Bob Jane "handbook" you get when you buy tyres. It's more or less correct for fronts, but not quite for rears (least not ours anyway). A good rule of thumb nevertheless.

Street driving even on longer trips shouldn't result in more than 5-6 PSI variation.

You may find left/right variation depending on what you've just done prior to measurement. Still best if you know what the difference is from dead cold.

The possibility of the Placebo effect did cross my mind but it does feel like that there is less lag, even the wife noticed it. It could be that the stiffened chassis is allowing the engine with transfer power to the wheels more effectively, rather than being dissipated through as vibration through the chassis. :iono:

Still pretty sure it is placebo :biggrin:
Things that affect "lag" apart from the intake/turbo mods include different engine mounts, TAI, anything that improves wheelspin or contact patch.
Stiffening the body should have NO impact bar the slight improvement in suspension which is negligible when talking about lag.
I think you're just getting a little more rev happy!

There are several sections on the OPH where the car will bottom out and scrape the lower lip and the car not even lowered.

Usually poor damping (can't control spring compression well enough). Stiffen springs too much and you get a pretty hard ride and/or skittish one.
Only way to know is to do a back to back.

Yeah - good company again. Could only keep up in the short tighter twisties (section after Moonie Moonie), the slightly longer flowing ones (after the turn off to Peat's Ridge) where there are longer stretches to accelerate, still scare the $%%^ outta me - I don't trust my skills, brakes and suspension enough.

Fast is fast enough. The rest will come once you take the car at the limit on track.

The wife and I would be up for Adv driver training lessons.
Was it through Ian Luff?
Cost?

No, was thru a Canberra mob (Saad is/was in Canberra).
Fifth Gear motoring
http://www.fifthgear.com.au

About mid-higher 200's. Will be less for those who have a valid Wakefield licence ($50 less)
But as I said, need to do ANY level 1 first. Main thing from that is learning what the brakes do (plus how to modulate it in cases like avoiding stationary cars).
Level 2 does the rest of the cornering stuff + car at limits.

Update:

Took rear left tyre off..
Puncture... F@*K!!!!!
its a huge piece of metal

Front left tyre has no punctures :D

Well at least you know it works (TPMS).
GL with the probable new tyre. If you get 2, new ones at front!

Would it be worthwhile to try to get a small 'Nthn drive' group together for advanced training at EC sometime?

EC has lots of walls - Wakefield (aka "kiddy track" has none except for front straight which you shouldn't hit). Further to go, but much safer if you go past the car's limit (which i recommend you do, as there's no other safer place to do it!)
 

Capercat

It's a chuck-about
Location
Location :)
Brilliant day out, I'll cut & paste the write up from the Porsche Forum in due course, learn't some new things from both cars today! :thumbsup:
 

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triode12

Go Kart Champion
Location
Sydney
Still pretty sure it is placebo :biggrin:
Things that affect "lag" apart from the intake/turbo mods include different engine mounts, TAI, anything that improves wheelspin or contact patch.
Stiffening the body should have NO impact bar the slight improvement in suspension which is negligible when talking about lag.
I think you're just getting a little more rev happy!

Ok - perhaps you are right.

No, was thru a Canberra mob (Saad is/was in Canberra).
Fifth Gear motoring
http://www.fifthgear.com.au

About mid-higher 200's. Will be less for those who have a valid Wakefield licence ($50 less)
But as I said, need to do ANY level 1 first. Main thing from that is learning what the brakes do (plus how to modulate it in cases like avoiding stationary cars).
Level 2 does the rest of the cornering stuff + car at limits.

Just visited their site, what is level 1? Defensive driving?
 

funny

VCDS guru & soon Dad x2 !
Location
Sydney
Car(s)
Golf MkV GTI MY07
Looking forward to the writeup Capercat.

Level 1 = Defensive driving Triode12. Most are essentially the same - with main emphasis being able to come away knowing how to brake hard, some basic info on human reactions to an emergency and accident avoidance. Most will also let you practice accident avoidance as well (I know the Luff one I did at the now non-existant Oran Park).

Level 2 usually works on driving essentials like understanding under/over steer, cornering techniques (speed in/out, early/on/late apex), braking/acceleration control and relation to steering and generally fanging the car at/over the limit.

Level 3 usually track focussed (time, tips & tricks on the track in question).

There's also the drift courses too (not really road useable in fwd).

Like I said though, some people do level 2 w/o level 1 and the learning curve is so steep (because it's hard to test the braking limits when you have to turn and worry about cars behind you) that they don't come away with anywhere near as much as they do having done level 1 beforehand.
 

triode12

Go Kart Champion
Location
Sydney
Looking forward to the writeup Capercat.

Level 1 = Defensive driving Triode12. Most are essentially the same - with main emphasis being able to come away knowing how to brake hard, some basic info on human reactions to an emergency and accident avoidance. Most will also let you practice accident avoidance as well (I know the Luff one I did at the now non-existant Oran Park).

Level 2 usually works on driving essentials like understanding under/over steer, cornering techniques (speed in/out, early/on/late apex), braking/acceleration control and relation to steering and generally fanging the car at/over the limit.

Level 3 usually track focussed (time, tips & tricks on the track in question).

There's also the drift courses too (not really road useable in fwd).

Like I said though, some people do level 2 w/o level 1 and the learning curve is so steep (because it's hard to test the braking limits when you have to turn and worry about cars behind you) that they don't come away with anywhere near as much as they do having done level 1 beforehand.

Thanks - in this case, I've actually done a level 1 course before but that was a long time ago. Perhaps I should do it as a refresher.
 

Bizi

Jetta with Rice
Location
Sydney
Car(s)
Jetta MY07
Glad you guys had a drive today - isn't the point of this board to post up drives?
 
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