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Old 03-30-2019, 09:46 AM   #1
oldmanriver
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MK5 Engine swap

Hello I found a nice 2007 Gulf GTI with a bad engine (owner ran the oil dry).

I'm new to VW's and have been doing some research.. With this vehicle having the FSI 2.0t what would be acceptable engine replacement it appears that another fsi 2.0t from year(s) 2006 - 2008.5 would be the obvious choice. How much of a process would it be to use an engine from another donor vehicle newer TSI or a FSI from an Audi...?

Is the Audi FSI set up the same as the GTI FSI? I wouldn't mind moving parts between long blocks but I'd like to stay away from any type of computer flashing / reprogramming, which I would assume would come with FSI to TSI if in fact it can be done.

So in short what would be my options as far as keeping labor time and aggravation to a minimum!

Thanks in advance!
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Old 03-31-2019, 02:25 AM   #2
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Any BPY based FSI will work. MK6 Golf R, 05-08.5 GTI/GLI/Wolfsburg, etc. The Audi 2.0 FSI VVT on both intake and exhaust cams, would be a lot of ECU work to get it right. TSI would be a nightmare swap and imho the worse motor.
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Old 03-31-2019, 10:56 AM   #3
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Thanks for the response! It should be model years 06 - 08.5 correct? Im still the new guy the 1.8 or 2.8 were the options in the 08's is what i came across while researching.

After sourcing a acceptable BPY do I need to consider any other factors in regards to the transmission for compatibility, any moving of parts from one to the other ect...?
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Old 04-01-2019, 12:28 AM   #4
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^^^
Nope, a BPY is a BPY.
And the transmission doesn't matter (that just bolts on--aka unrelated to the engine)
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Old 04-01-2019, 08:28 AM   #5
oldmanriver
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Thanks Snobrdran! I've completed engine swaps / replacements on tanks in my service days and on a handful of road vehicles. I just want to make sure I don't overlook anything, so is it that straightforward on theses GTI's even if an engine is moving between Auto <> Manual Transmissions... no issues with spacing etc...?
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Old 04-01-2019, 11:07 AM   #6
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Also just for further clarification these statements are being made form some eBay sellers regarding fitment. So could I run with what was mentioned above as far as BPY is BPY or is there additional steps / procedures if a BPY is sourced from an Audi or any other vehicles mentioned in the list below?

BPY 2.0T Engine Complete Long Block 05-10 VW Jetta GTI MK5 Audi A3 Passat Eos
PRODUCT INFO
Removed from: 2007 VW GTI 2.0T
Manufacturer Part Number: Does not apply
Compatible with:
Audi A3 06-08
Eos 07-08
GTI 06-07, 5th digit VIN V
GTI 08-09, 5th digit VIN D or V
Jetta 06
Jetta 07-08, 5th digit VIN J
Passat 06-08
Notes: Mileage: 157,000
Engine code: BPY
Brand: Volkswagen
Part Brand: Genuine Original Equipment VW / Audi OE Used Part
Condition: Used
Condition notes: Run tested, vehicle was run and drive before dismantling. HPFP cam follower inspected
Shipping notes:
Shipping to a commercial address that can handle freight
Must be shipped to address matched to payment
will not change address after purchase
Residential delivery available with extra cost
Warranty: Yes
Tested: Yes
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Old 04-01-2019, 09:15 PM   #7
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My son and I did an engine swap on a 2007 Jetta GLI (BPY engine). We ended up using another BPY from an Eos. The donor engine included the turbo and most everything else. You will want access to VCDS. We did end up having to recode the computer (disconnected from battery for too long?), but there was an online table somewhere with the correct codes. I may have a file somewhere with the info. You will at least need to reset the throttle body position limits with VCDS (or OBD11?) and we had to re-calibrate the steering angle sensor also.

Engine comes out the front. You can carefully move AC compressor and condensor to the side so you don't have to open the AC system and save that hassle/expense.

Engine should mate up to any transmission it was used with, but note that the flywheels changed depending on year and model. Use the flywheel that goes with the transmission you're using. We fought with it a long time before we learned that one.

Obviously, do as much maintenance on the "new" engine before it goes in... timing belt, water pump, HPFP, hoses, etc.

Take good notes and pictures and label everything. All in all it was fairly straightforward given how big of a task it was. Feel free to ask me any questions.

-Mike

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Old 04-01-2019, 09:40 PM   #8
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Keep in mind that you won't be able to fully test the car... who knows what else will be wrong. Transmission, brakes, axles, suspension, etc. If someone didn't take care of the car enough to run it out of oil, who knows what else they didn't take care of.

In retrospect, I would probably still have done the engine swap, but it's the rest of the car that made the whole project questionable. In our case, it was part of a 16 year old's education, so there was a lot of value in that for us.

-Mike

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Old 04-02-2019, 08:08 PM   #9
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Thanks for the heads up on the flywheel. I should have it tomorrow. I may just try to source an engine from the auction, but wanted to know my options, especially those with the least resistance! Keep me in mind if you think of any more of those flywheel circumstances... I hate kicking myself in the ass, Like I did a few weeks ago... spent a day on what I convinced myself was a fuel issue on my 6.5 Detroit when it was a latex glove in the turbo. I just completed some maintenance on the turbo, wastegate, Vac lines, glow plugs etc... and I (Knew) I buttoned it right
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Old 04-03-2019, 01:44 PM   #10
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Audi engines are a little different, try to stay with a VW BPY to avoid headaches.
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Old 04-03-2019, 06:10 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldmanriver View Post
Keep me in mind if you think of any more of those flywheel circumstances...
Feel free to PM me if you run into something that doesn't look or feel right. I'm just a shadetree mechanic and not a professional but this car has really taught me some ins and outs with the BPY.

Like... if you are pulling the intake manifold off for any reason, the fuel rail comes with the manifold and the injectors may come with the fuel rail or stay in the head. Either way, don't try and put them back together with the injectors in the fuel rail. Take the injectors off the fuel rail and put them in the head and make sure the blue o-rings are on the injectors NOT the fuel rail! I got to pull the manifold twice on that one! If pulling the manifold or in injectors for any reason, I recommend replacing all the injector o-rings and clips. VW says to replace the o-rings every time. You can get maintenance kits from the dealer or online dealer with all the parts you need. ~$25/injector. HOWEVER, there is a special toolkit you need to install the little white combustion chamber o-rings on the injectors.

I don't exactly remember which wiring harness we used, but we did completely remove and install the wiring harness and removed the computer to do so. Wish I remembered why we did that, but avoid it if you can.

-Mike


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Last edited by FloridaNative; 04-04-2019 at 12:23 AM.
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Old 04-06-2019, 11:28 PM   #12
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I found a FSI out of a 2007 Passat Wolfsberg that should be a go for my 07 GTI... Right?
Just have to double check... Its a 9hr round trip.

Finally got started. Tied up tomorrow so no wrench turning. I'll have make the drive on Mon for the engine... and try to complete the swap on Tues... Maybe
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Old 04-07-2019, 08:10 AM   #13
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Don't know your facility/abilities/skill set, but a one day swap for an amateur without a shop is overly optimistic in my book. Even if the old engine is already out and you have all needed parts on hand. Keep in mind you still need to "refresh" the "new" engine before it goes in.

Oh, and not sure how you're planning it, but we pulled engine and trans as one unit then swapped trans onto "new" engine outside car. I wouldn't want to try it any other way.

-Mike

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Old 04-07-2019, 08:15 AM   #14
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I believe (but not 100% sure), the 5th digit of a Passat VIN should be a "K" to indicate a BPY.

If you want to disconnect the noisemaker on your GTI, have them throw in the Passat charged air pipe that goes between the intercooler and throttle body.

-Mike

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Old 04-07-2019, 10:11 AM   #15
oldmanriver
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Thanks Mike yes the 5th is a K on the Passat. I've tried a few times to find a good resource on how to ID BPY engines with the VIN but get mixed results, do you know a source that uses the VIN to ID engine type. Id request the info to confirm but its an auction car and you have to be on site to acquire any info they haven't released.

I did notice that the Passat doesn't have the charge pipe that runs from the firewall to the throttle body, this shouldn't be a problem to use pipe from the GTI I would assume
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Old 04-07-2019, 10:15 AM   #16
oldmanriver
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Unless its routed differently. I can see a grommet at the firewall on the passat where the pipe was present on mt GTI
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Old 04-07-2019, 11:45 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FloridaNative View Post
Don't know your facility/abilities/skill set, but a one day swap for an amateur without a shop is overly optimistic in my book. Even if the old engine is already out and you have all needed parts on hand. Keep in mind you still need to "refresh" the "new" engine before it goes in.

Oh, and not sure how you're planning it, but we pulled engine and trans as one unit then swapped trans onto "new" engine outside car. I wouldn't want to try it any other way.

-Mike

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x2 on taking your time and "refreshing" before installing.
Timing belt and cam chain / tensioner
water pump / thermostat
accessory belt / pulleys
high pressure fuel pump cam follower
diverter valve - get new D type with piston NOT older one with diaphragm

i would check and replace as necessary all turbo hoses (remove and pressure check, tears can be hidden. Same goes for the vacuum hoses. There is at least one that is pretty brittle that is a common issue (brake booster)

These motors with higher mileage tend to have oil leaks in a couple of areas. One is the vacuum pump, which can be rebuilt. The other which is quite difficult / near impossible to replace once motor installed is the oil filter housing assembly. It is plastic and over the years does tend to crack and leak.
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Old 04-07-2019, 04:28 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldmanriver View Post
Thanks Mike yes the 5th is a K on the Passat. I've tried a few times to find a good resource on how to ID BPY engines with the VIN but get mixed results, do you know a source that uses the VIN to ID engine type. Id request the info to confirm but its an auction car and you have to be on site to acquire any info they haven't released.

I did notice that the Passat doesn't have the charge pipe that runs from the firewall to the throttle body, this shouldn't be a problem to use pipe from the GTI I would assume
I don't know of a definitive source for ID'ing BPY. Just internet searches, checking multiple sites to confirm each other, etc.

Regarding the charge air pipe, yes, the Passat and GTI are (more or less) interchangeable. You can re-use your GTI one no problem. The GLI that we were working with has the same noisemaker as the GTI which we did NOT want. We used the Passat air pipe which doesn't have the offshoot that runs air to the resonator and then we closed up the resonator opening at the firewall.

-Mike

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Old 04-07-2019, 06:02 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by FloridaNative View Post
I don't know of a definitive source for ID'ing BPY. Just internet searches, checking multiple sites to confirm each other, etc.

Regarding the charge air pipe, yes, the Passat and GTI are (more or less) interchangeable. You can re-use your GTI one no problem. The GLI that we were working with has the same noisemaker as the GTI which we did NOT want. We used the Passat air pipe which doesn't have the offshoot that runs air to the resonator and then we closed up the resonator opening at the firewall.

-Mike

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The motor itself will have a stamp on it (little ear coming off the head - visible if you have engine cover off) and it will have BPY stamped into the metal or whatever engine code the motor is.
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Old 04-07-2019, 09:09 PM   #20
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That Passat engine is the same as your GTI

It just doesn't have the noisemaker pipe, which most people delete anyways. And if you wanted to keep it, for whatever reason, just swap the throttle body pipe from the GTI motor to the new Passat engine & hook up that noisemaker "plumbing" when it's back in the GTI
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Old 04-07-2019, 09:31 PM   #21
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Well I just in after a long day and was preparing to make the drive to NY to physically look over and confirm the Passat engine was good to go. The auction site had it listed as a "run and drive" but I like to see things 1st hand. As I click a series of links I came across some info... apparently you have to have a license or use a broker in NY (Not in PA). As I as typing this I went back to read up on some of the brokers... looks like some will complete an inspection on your behalf to verify the sellers listed info. I'll take a shot in the AM to see if I can catch one on short notice, if it works out I wouldn't mind paying the broker fees, for the peace of mind, and it allows me to get back after pulling the GTI
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Old 04-07-2019, 10:52 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by FloridaNative View Post
I don't know of a definitive source for ID'ing BPY. Just internet searches, checking multiple sites to confirm each other, etc.

Regarding the charge air pipe, yes, the Passat and GTI are (more or less) interchangeable. You can re-use your GTI one no problem. The GLI that we were working with has the same noisemaker as the GTI which we did NOT want. We used the Passat air pipe which doesn't have the offshoot that runs air to the resonator and then we closed up the resonator opening at the firewall.

-Mike

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The motor itself will have a stamp on it (little ear coming off the head - visible if you have engine cover off) and it will have BPY stamped into the metal or whatever engine code the motor is.

Pic below shows the stamp on an Audi motor, same on VW.

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