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The COVID19 SCAMdemic... Economy So Strong That eBay Hard Up For Business

MagicMK

Drag Racing Champion
Location
PA
So you think the Middle East was an awesome, problem free place before September 11, 2001? At a minimum, you have to go back to Sykes-Picot, but it's really way before that.

Also, ISIS was the result of our untimely departure from Iraq (I wonder if the same thing will happen in Afghanistan?) Yes, Obama inherited it, but that doesn't give him carte blanche to f**k it up. The ISIS leadership were former AQI who developed their network in the Bucca prison camp and were released following major US withdrawal in 2011.
Comeonnnn Mannnnn... I never said that. I've read all types of stuff on the Middle East. I'm very well versed on the Middle East and Afghanistan and Iraq, in particular. ISIS was formed well before we left Iraq. Also, it was America's obsession with Communism and the USSR that lead us to get involved in Afghanistan. We should have just left it alone and never supported the Mujahadeen that later became the Taliban, that later supported al-Qaeda.... that later supported the 9/11 attacks.
 

GTIfan99

Autocross Champion
Location
FL
That's the distinction I'm trying to make though. You can't just say someone is worse because a Nazi supported them. You can say that someone is worse for actively courting white nationalists, adopting their policies, refusing to condemn their actions, etc.

Fair.

And the GOP under Trump is actively courting white nationalists, adopting their policies, and refusing to condemn them.

Though it started before that. Obama was basically an 80 republican and the GOP blew that dog whistle as hard as they could for 8 years, which is how we ended up with Trump.
 

MagicMK

Drag Racing Champion
Location
PA
There's a big difference between actions sanctioned by the UN and NATO operations. They are not the same thing even if they share the letter N.

I can't be living in lalaland about republicans because i don't give a shit about either party -- they are both war mongering imperialists. Watching you rip yourself a new one in here over the dem/rep fight is hilarious. Keep it up.
Oh come on, you're a Libertarian which is really a Republican that never came out of the closet. You don't support Democrats, so quit pretending you "dislike both sides equally." Also, I know the difference between NATO and the UN, but I'm not looking everything up as I type. That's besides the point, though... you're clearly much more critical of Dems than you ever are of anything Republicans do. You're the equivalent of Fox News BS moniker "Fair and Balanced." Now there's a laugh... :LOL:
 

npace

Autocross Champion
Location
Netherlands
So Vox is a bad source, but the stranger is a valid source for information and opinions?

Just trying to figure out how this "both sides" stuff works.
Both sides of what? The article I linked to actually cites multiple academic journals and publications, something that no article in Vox does.
 

anotero

Autocross Champion
Location
Hither and thither
Car(s)
Mk7 GTI
Oh come on, you're a Libertarian which is really a Republican that never came out of the closet. You don't support Democrats, so quit pretending you "dislike both sides equally." Also, I know the difference between NATO and the UN, but I'm not looking everything up as I type. That's besides the point, though... you're clearly much more critical of Dems than you ever are of anything Republicans do. You're the equivalent of Fox News BS moniker "Fair and Balanced." Now there's a laugh... :LOL:

You are a confused little child. I'm as far from libertarianism as nazis are from loving Jews.

I pound on dems in this thread because:
1. Their supporters in here are more aggressive, and it's boring to beat on the quiet ones.
2. While reps are more blunt about their intentions, dems are constantly putting on a façade, as if they care about regular people. I don't like pretenders, and i naturally go after the fakers.

In the end, if both parties have a fight to the death and annihilate each other, the regular people will only benefit.
 

npace

Autocross Champion
Location
Netherlands
Okay, that was a UN Security Council decision that Obama acted upon, but that doesn't mean I agreed with it. I'm okay if a bunch of Libyans died trying to overthrow Quadaffi - not our war. The difference between Democrats and Republicans is that we can disagree with our leaders. Republicans follow lock step with everything they say... Trump was a massive idiot and lied all the time. How many Republicans in power actually ever challenged him. CNN beats up on Biden, constantly... Fox never finished sucking Trump's d!@k to stop and take a breath to tell him he was wrong about anything (with a few very minor exceptions).

I never said a Republican Congress approved action against Libya. Read closely what I wrote. Congress has War Powers, the president does not. The Presidents since 9/11 have been operating under some MOU that allows the President to take unilateral action w/o declaring war. I know that and have known that - that's why I wrote what I wrote very carefully. Republicans could have stopped Obama and Trump for that matter... they never did and Democrats still have not as of today.
You literally said: " Btw, I seem to recall that war powers reside with Congress, and both Clinton and Obama had rather active Republican Congresses during their respective 2 terms in office." You were implying, if not outright stating, that the Republican controlled congress gave power to Obama to bomb Libya.

And the AUMF is not "some MOU". It was an authorization by Congress for Bush to wage those wars, something Obama never got for Libya (or Syria for that matter).
 

npace

Autocross Champion
Location
Netherlands
Comeonnnn Mannnnn... I never said that. I've read all types of stuff on the Middle East. I'm very well versed on the Middle East and Afghanistan and Iraq, in particular. ISIS was formed well before we left Iraq. Also, it was America's obsession with Communism and the USSR that lead us to get involved in Afghanistan. We should have just left it alone and never supported the Mujahadeen that later became the Taliban, that later supported al-Qaeda.... that later supported the 9/11 attacks.
We didn't leave Iraq in 2011, we withdrew combat troops, and left Advise and Assist Brigades, which had a different mission. You heavily implied that all the current trappings of the ME are because of Bush, which is just plain ridiculous.
 

Escape Hatch

Autocross Champion
Location
USA
Car(s)
Mk7 GTI

GTIfan99

Autocross Champion
Location
FL
Both sides of what? The article I linked to actually cites multiple academic journals and publications, something that no article in Vox does.

You tell me, you're the both sides guy.

Are you claiming vox doesn't ever cite academic sources?

Hell, zrickety cites academic sources all time, them goes on to out right lie or misrepresent what they say.

And I thought the stranger was when you sit on your hand till it goes numb, then masterbate.
 

anotero

Autocross Champion
Location
Hither and thither
Car(s)
Mk7 GTI
This article is a little deep for most, but it describes what I am trying to say better and more succinctly than I can or want to here. Read it or don't, whatever:

https://www.thestranger.com/slog/20...y-still-dont-know-what-they-are-talking-about

That is one of the most superficial analyses of socialism I've seen.
First and foremost socialism is an economic system, whereas nazism/fascism is more of a social system based on the capitalist economic system. Economy is the basis that dictates everything that's built upon it. So fascism/nazism is not close (or equal) to socialism because fascism is a derivative of capitalism.
 

GTIfan99

Autocross Champion
Location
FL
We didn't leave Iraq in 2011, we withdrew combat troops, and left Advise and Assist Brigades, which had a different mission. You heavily implied that all the current trappings of the ME are because of Bush, which is just plain ridiculous.

Reagan and HW heavily contributed too... so there's that.
 

jimlloyd40

Autocross Champion
Location
Phoenix
Car(s)
2018 SE DSG
I get that, both parties have things I agree with and don't agree with.

But you supported the worst of what the GOP has to offer. Pure populist white nationalist drivel that won't solve any of the issues our country faces.
I supported what I considered to be the lesser of two bad candidates. I have stated that I won't in the future and is why I changed to independent. And I'm not going to argue about it.
 

torga

Autocross Champion
Location
Seattle
Car(s)
'11 GTI
This article is a little deep for most, but it describes what I am trying to say better and more succinctly than I can or want to here. Read it or don't, whatever:

https://www.thestranger.com/slog/20...y-still-dont-know-what-they-are-talking-about
So Vox is a bad source, but the stranger is a valid source for information and opinions?

Just trying to figure out how this "both sides" stuff works.

Oh neat. Is The Stranger a pretty widespread publication? I know you can find almost anything from almost every part of the world on the internet, just curious if y'all have heard of The Stranger before. I'd never heard of them until I moved to the PNW -- they're a local Seattle publication. They're a very progressive voice around here.
 

torga

Autocross Champion
Location
Seattle
Car(s)
'11 GTI
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