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General Car, Inferior or Superior Interior, & Eternal Mullet Barge Discussion Thread

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intoflatlines

intoflatlines

Drag Race Newbie
Location
Chicagoland
Car(s)
MK7.5 GTI SE 6MT
PetrolHead said:
I don't care about any car's drivetrain layout if it's setup properly. While I tend to prefer RWD, it's only because they're naturally a bit easier to dial in to my driving preference. Still, a FoST does a great job at being a front driver. I think it's a marvel of engineering that the R could produce 360hp with zero tq steer FWD. That would be a riot to drive. You just have to admit that we've been conditioned to expect tq steer from high HP front drivers because nobody's really been able to do it right yet.
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I don't see why torque steer (or lack thereof) is something to get caught up with. It's more important to have good weight distribution / chassis balance IMO, something that FWD cars almost never have.
 
grambles423

grambles423

Automotive Engineer
Location
Alabama
Car(s)
2008 GTI
intoflatlines said:
I don't see why torque steer (or lack thereof) is something to get caught up with. It's more important to have good weight distribution / chassis balance IMO, something that FWD cars almost never have.
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Quote from Mule Review:

Hasshi-san and his engineering boffins chose front-drive rather than A45 AMG-style all-wheel drive, and I think they made the right call. The big potential problem, with so much power being parcelled through the front wheels, is torque steer. But, as we blast out onto the circuit, all 300 horses being unleashed up front, there is little steering fidget or histrionics. The car tracks straight and true. This is a welcome surprise. As we later discover, it is also a much crisper and more interactive companion than the leaden A45 AMG. Four-wheel drive so often mutes a car’s responsiveness, and the Type R is much the better for being two-wheel drive only. It is a delightfully responsive little car.
Click to expand...
 
intoflatlines

intoflatlines

Drag Race Newbie
Location
Chicagoland
Car(s)
MK7.5 GTI SE 6MT
grambles423 said:
Quote from Mule Review:
Click to expand...
That pretty much reinforces my point, they're still talking about how awesome it is because it doesn't have torque steer. And I'm no fan of AWD for a sports/sporty street car either thanks to the added weight and plowing in the corners that's inherent of of most AWD. Of course a FWD car is more responsive than AWD. IMO, the only things AWD is good for are straight line acceleration from a stop and keeping you from getting into too much trouble (for the average driver) if you start to slide in a corner. And rallying/off roading of course.
 
PetrolHead

PetrolHead

When's the next track day
Location
Motor City
Car(s)
MKVI GTI
grambles423 said:
Quote from Mule Review:
Click to expand...

This is the benefit of FWD to AWD. I've never driven an AWD car that I really got connected to. Muted and a bit dull is pretty accurate. FWD being lighter has the potential to be more nimble, direct, and tossable. The main concerns are balance (much front weight) and Tq steer. Balance can be tuned out with suspension (FoST), but Tq steer is a bigger problem. It usually results in tq limiting in certain gears, which to me takes a bit of the direct feeling out of the car. A JCW MINI for example will snap your wrist if you give it the beans, which requires throttle modulation on the driver's part. I'd rather do that myself than the car, because I like knowing that the only limiting factor to the car's performance is my inputs. The ultimate is a suspension design that alleviates tq steer inherently mechanically. There's been some pretty big development there (equal length half shafts, GM's Hiper Strut, Ford's RevoKnuckle), and given Honda's past of taking other's ideas and perfecting them, I have a lot of confidence that it could be really well executed.
 
johnny_p

johnny_p

Go Kart Champion
Location
Philadelphia


Honda now has the world's fastest lawnmower record. 116 MPH. Holy hell.
http://www.autoblog.com/2014/04/02/honda-worlds-fastest-lawnmower-video/#continued
 
grambles423

grambles423

Automotive Engineer
Location
Alabama
Car(s)
2008 GTI
johnny_p

johnny_p

Go Kart Champion
Location
Philadelphia
PetrolHead said:
This is the benefit of FWD to AWD. I've never driven an AWD car that I really got connected to. Muted and a bit dull is pretty accurate. FWD being lighter has the potential to be more nimble, direct, and tossable. The main concerns are balance (much front weight) and Tq steer. Balance can be tuned out with suspension (FoST), but Tq steer is a bigger problem. It usually results in tq limiting in certain gears, which to me takes a bit of the direct feeling out of the car. A JCW MINI for example will snap your wrist if you give it the beans, which requires throttle modulation on the driver's part. I'd rather do that myself than the car, because I like knowing that the only limiting factor to the car's performance is my inputs. The ultimate is a suspension design that alleviates tq steer inherently mechanically. There's been some pretty big development there (equal length half shafts, GM's Hiper Strut, Ford's RevoKnuckle), and given Honda's past of taking other's ideas and perfecting them, I have a lot of confidence that it could be really well executed.
Click to expand...

Front suspension geometry, equal length drive shafts, and electric steering all work together to combat torque steer. Actually with today's electric steering racks alone I bet you can dial it all out.
 
grambles423

grambles423

Automotive Engineer
Location
Alabama
Car(s)
2008 GTI
PetrolHead said:
Sure, at the expense of steering feel and connection.
Click to expand...

Another common misconception.

There is still mechanical linkage, your booster is just electro mechanical instead of hydraulic. Its all how you tune it.
 
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